In and Out of Rebel Prisons

This week Al mackey highlights the Book “In and Out of Rebel Prisons” by Alonzo Cooper at– https://studycivilwar.wordpress.com/2015/03/26/in-and-out-of-rebel-prisons/#comments

I agree that no prison cam on either side was a desired place to be, but Mr. Cooper there are a couple of things you should know. It was your participation in an illegal war that resulted in your capture and imprisonment in Andersonville. It was the greed and the determination of United States Presidents to collect “revenue” from the South that caused this illegal war Blame yourself, Blame them.

It was the actions of your President Lincoln and your General Grant that caused your continued confinement in Andersonville. These are the men who choose not to let exchanges continue. Blame them.

If not you at least some of your messmate burned, murdered old men women and children of all races in the South. Anything that could be carried away was taken, what could not be stolen was destroyed. Women were raped and sent North, people were starved and abused in all sorts of manner. yet you dare to complain about you conditions? Are you going to blame these civilians?

Yes please tell us how the Confederate POWs lived a life of luxury in plaves like camp Chase and Elmira. perhaps if they had not been deliberately treated as badly as they were we would not have this facts —

United States prisoners held in Southern prisons, . 270,000
United States prisoners died in Southern prisons, . 22,000
About 8 per cent.

Confederate prisoners held in Northern prisons, . . 220,000
Confederate prisoners died in Northern prisons, . . 26,000
About 12 per cent.

Source: A SOLDIER’S STORY, MILES O. SHERRILL, page 5

About the Negroes, 500 yards. Are you sure they had surrendered, no knives obeying the orders of their captors?? 500 yards really?I couldn’t find any after action report that supports your statement, but there is one witness account in the Official Records. Perhaps this could be a result of ya’ll burning the town of Plymouth?

As I have stated before, Andersonville was a result of you following your President in a illegal war. But that is really another issue. We know the Confederates provided for the men under them as best as they could given the conditions of the war at that time. This is proven by a fellow you may have met —

“I am certainly no admirer of Jefferson Davis or the late Confederacy, but in justice to him and that the truth may be known, I would state that I was a prisoner of war for twelve months, and was in Andersonville when the delegation of prisoners spoken of by Jefferson Davis left there to plead our cause to with the authorities at Washington; and nobody can tell, unless it be a shipwrecked and famished mariner, who sees a vessel approaching and then passing on without rendering aid, what fond hopes were raised, and how hope sickened into despair waiting for the answer that never came.

In my opinion, and that of a good many others, a good part of the responsibility for the horrors of Anderson rests with General U.S. Grant, who refused to make a fair exchange of prisoners.”

Henry M. Brennan, Late Private, Second Pennsylvania Cavalry”

(Southern Historical Society Papers, Volume I, page 318)

Now we also know that your own general Sherman had this to say about the POWs in Andersonville–
These I ordered back, and offered General Hood to exchange them for Stoneman, Buell, and such of my own army as would make up the equivalent; but I would not exchange for his prisoners generally, because I knew these would have to be sent to their own regiments, away from my army, whereas all we could give him could at once be put to duty in his immediate army.
From his Memoirs CHAPTER XIX. CAPTURE OF ATLANTA.
Blame your leaders not the Confederates.

You and your other loyal patriots came South to fight a war of greed. To bad you left your humanity at home and had to pay the price for your actions.

********************************

War of the Rebellion: Serial 120 Introduction
‘The Confederates would soon run out of men, but it meant they had to cope with unprecedented numbers of Union prisoners while the Confederacy was running short of everything, including food.”
War of the Rebellion: Serial 121 Page 0603 CORRESPONDENCE, ETC.-UNION AND CONFEDERATE.

The Texas Plates Case Drives to the Court

Al Mackey made a reasonable post at https://studycivilwar.wordpress.com/2015/03/24/the-texas-plates-case-drives-to-the-court/ Concerning the issue of Texas getting a Sons Of Confederate Veterans tags with the SCV logo displayed. I think most reasonable people can agree with the right of freedom of speech. Honestly I have no problem with Mackey’s blog post. I do however have a problem with the dimwitted comment made by one Jimmy Dick —-

Jimmy Dick · March 24, 2015 – 3:48 am · Reply→

I wonder whether they can insert words that racist symbols cannot be used on the plates because the use of the symbol out of its natural historical context is meant to be racist and to inspire hate crimes as a result.

I’m sure the current make up of the SCOTUS would ignore any studies showing the racism involved with non-historical use of the CBF leads to hate crimes. You know very well that the heritage groups ignore that point.

Well Jimmy because of your comment,  this one’s for you —-

Two Men are Lynched in Marion, Indiana

Notice not one Confederate Battleflag in sight???? Story found at http://travelingwithtwain.org/2011/10/06/general/revisiting-lynchings-in-marion-indiana/

Never let it be said—-

The NAACP was formed to combat atrocities in the South.

From http://www.naacp.org/pages/naacp-history

Founding group
The NAACP was formed partly in response to the continuing horrific practice of lynching and the 1908 race riot in Springfield, the capital of Illinois and resting place of President Abraham Lincoln. Appalled at the violence that was committed against blacks, a group of white liberals that included Mary White Ovington and Oswald Garrison Villard, both the descendants of abolitionists, William English Walling and Dr. Henry Moscowitz issued a call for a meeting to discuss racial justice. Some 60 people, seven of whom were African American (including W. E. B. Du Bois, Ida B. Wells-Barnett and Mary Church Terrell), signed the call, which was released on the centennial of Lincoln’s birth.

“Colored” Confederate Women

Just recently I found these cards in Fold3. There is at least 3 women whose cards a very similar, but I am only posting one. There is no mention they are slaves, although that possibility exists. If they are slaves, these women would still be part of the Confederate army. They are duly enlisted and paid soldiers.

Sorry but I know nothing about the 63rd Georgia of Thunderbolt Battery.

****************************************************************************************

Page 1

Page 2

Page 3

Hummmmm????

Ever notice the Sons of Union Veterans and the Sons of United States Colored Troops are still separate groups????

http://www.suvcw.org/?page_id=129 — You must directly descend from a Soldier, Sailor, Marine or member of the Revenue Cutter Service (or directly descend from a brother, sister, half-brother, or half-sister of such Soldier, etc.) who was regularly mustered and served honorably in, was honorably discharged from, or died in the service of, the Army, Navy, Marine Corps or Revenue Cutter Service of the United States of America or in such state regiments called to active service and was subject to the orders of United States general officers, between April 12, 1861 and April 9, 1865.

USCT —  Descendant Members: Will be those who have established an ancestral link to ancestors of black or white soldiers that served in the USCT.

So in this age of being inclusive, why are they still separate groups????

Could this be the reason????

************************************************************

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/abstract.html?res=9501E0D8143AE533A2575AC0A96E9C94609ED7CF

They May Withdraw
Southern Grand Army Men Won’t Affiliate With Colored Veterans:
The New York Times, August 9, 1891

New Orleans: August 8—-Angry, disappointed, bordering on indignation, was expressed on all sides by the leading spirits of the Grand Army posts here when the news was received that colored veterans must be given free recognition and admission to the order. The greater part of the officers of the white posts are ensconced in comfortable berths in the Custom House, and there is indignation over the action of the national body was greatest.

Private telegrams announced that under the new decision matters would remain as heretofore. “That means,” said a prominent Federal official, “that we will act as we did last year and just decline to allow colored posts representation in the Department Council. If we are forced to give then recognition, we will probably surrender our charter and then convert our organization into a social, fraternal and benevolent order for white ex-soldiers.”

This is the general sentiment expressed by all white veterans. The demand for recognition in the Grand Army of the Republic ranks by the Negroes is regarded as a political move of their leaders. Colonel Jim Lewis is charged with desiring to elect himself Department Commander so as to secure a fat Federal office. The white veterans give as one of the reasons for their dissatisfaction the fact that large numbers of the members of the colored posts are only thirty or thirty-five years old, and consequently could not have been old enough to bear a musket in the war. It is said that when the late Department Commander, Jacob Gray, saw he could not be re-elected by the white posts, he granted enough charters to colored posts to accomplish that object, but he was checked by the political shrewdness of the white delegates.

To organize eight colored posts in as many days required rapid work, and it is charged that men were mustered into the new posts 100 at a time without the production of their discharge papers or, indeed, any further investigation into the question whether they served or not (other) than their own statements. The white Grand Army members in Louisiana number over a thousand. If they cut off from all connection with the national organization, it is very probable the other Southern States contending with the same problem will also withdraw, and that they will all unite in one grand organization limited to the South, and surrender to the colored comrades the control as well as the membership of the regular Grand Army organization in their States.

Another singular complication arises from the fact that the Negro brigade which fought with such unquestioned gallantry on the right of the Federal line at Port Hudson (and of which Lewis and most of the Grand Army claimants are members) was made up of the original native grand guard regiments which were organized under authority from Richmond and sworn into the Confederate service before the capture of this city by Butler, which fact would disbar them from membership in the Grand Army.

(the last statement in bold is not quite true)

Racism

Black racism is fine, white racism is a no-no. I just found that out. For an example let’s take a look at this blog post on Freedman’s patrol at https://freedmenspatrol.wordpress.com/2015/03/09/keeping-the-skeer-on/

The post is about the billboard with Forrest’s picture at Selma. The blogger goes on to say that Forrest formed the KKK, killed thousands of Black, murdered USCT at Fort Pillow etc. etc. You know the drill. he alsogoes on tosaythe Goodwin’s are racist because they dared to utter the words — WHITE HERITAGE – . gasp I have said it now!!!!!!!!!!!

At any rate I corrected some of these out and out lies that the blogger posted, and really did get him grudgingly to admit that that two facts were wrong. More importantly I steered him to the subject of Black History Month, which by any set of standards is racist in its very nature. This fellow defended the celebration of Black history to the very end.

SO TELL ME WHAT IS THE DIFFERENCE??? If the celebration of white history and heritage is racist, then why isn’t the celebration of Black History or the celebration of any ethnic history racist? If one is to be honored all should be honored.

Getting back — anyway this Freedman blogger in a half hearted attempt to correct his outright ignorance or lies, made another post at https://freedmenspatrol.wordpress.com/2015/03/12/two-small-corrections-on-forrest/

he still insists that Forrest was a fiounder of the KKK and his actions before, during and after the war was his based on “keep the skeer oon em.” he never once mentions that the Goodwins statements involving white heritage, is no more racist than Black history or heritage.

To make a long story short, I factually disputed everything he said, which just ruined his day. he got mad and banned me. That is typical of those from the other side.The last posts that I made do not show up but they all civil, no insults and deal with the racism. I did point out that I have done more research on Black Confederates than most people. So much for a discussion on race as Holder and Obama call for. Oh well.

Friends Of Forrest

Referring to the previous post Billboard Controversy (https://coldsouthernsteel.wordpress.com/2015/03/11/billboard-controversy/) here is a invitation and a little description of the group friends of Forrest.
*********************************************

TO ALL: PLEASE FORWARD TO EVERYONE IN YOUR ADDRESSBOOK, BLOGS, FACEBOOK, ETC. WHOM YOU DEEM WOULD BE INTERESTED. If you receive this message more than once, please forgive me and hit delete; there are many addresses in my addressbook that I don’t recognize. If you do not wish to receive any further messages from me, please advise and I will delete your address from my contacts. Thank you for your kind considerations.

We hope you ALL will make plans to attend this historic & monumental event!
We Won! We have the deed to Confederate Memorial Circle!
It’s time to Celebrate, Commemorate & Re-Dedicate!

The Friends of Forrest and Selma Chapter 53, UDC Cordially Invite You to Attend & Share The Celebration of our Historical & Monumental Victory!!!

Saturday, May 23, 2015 1:00 PM

Confederate Memorial Circle
Historic Live Oak Cemetery
Selma, Alabama

A Guided Tour of Live Oak Cemetery 9:30am

Reception to follow program at the Smitherman Building Museum
(The Original Site of the NB Forrest Monument)
109 Union Street

The host hotel is the Quality Inn here in Selma – 334-874-8600. I have blocked off 15 rooms at the Special Friends of Forrest rate of $69 per night plus tax. There are only 60 rooms in the hotel so call NOW for your reservations! May 23, 2015 is Memorial Day weekend. This will give out-of-towners an extra day for travel back home & work or to stay an extra day to tour Historic Selma! For more information contact: Pat Godwin at 334-875-1690; 334-419-4566 (cell) or e-mail: oldsouthrebel©zebra.net

Confederate Memorial Circle was originally dedicated 137 years ago on 26 April 1878. It’s time to celebrate, commemorate & re-dedicate Confederate Memorial Circle where we will re-dedicate the Nathan Bedford Forrest Monument by unveiling the REPLACEMENT bronze bust of Lt. General Nathan Bedford Forrest. We will re-dedicate the Confederate Soldiers’ Memorial and also the new Battle of Selma Memorial. This will be a HUGE MONUMENTAL HISTORICAL event- the most paramount Confederate accomplishment throughout the South in recent times because we beat the enemy in their own territory, the Civil Rights hotpot of the world! We have won our case against the City of Selma. Selma Chapter 53, UDC has been awarded the deed to the one acre Memorial Circle plus the Pigeoneers House! Our Security & Beautification Enhancement of Confederate Memorial Circle project has been quite a test of patience, endurance, perseverance and faithful dedication of all our supporters. We are very GRATEFUL for ALL our supporters and contributors toward our efforts to defend, protect and preserve our noble Southern history and heritage here in Selma. Even though we are having the dedication on May 23, this project is not quite finished. We still have LOTS to pay for and also erect 19 bronze historical interpretive markers throughout the Circle. These historical markers will cost approximately $1500 each. We are also still selling the ancestor pavers; (4×8 – 3 lines, 18 characters – $50; 8×8 – 6 lines, 18 characters, $65) if you want your paver laid by dedication day please place your order NOW! However, we will continue to sell the pavers until we have all 4 quads filled with engraved pavers. This entire project is TAXDOLLAR FREE – only private donations have funded this project! Contact me at 334-875-1690 for order form & information. If you would like to contribute to this historical, monumental project, please make check payable to and MARK FOR: CONFEDERATE

MEMORIAL CIRCLE:

NBF Monument Fund/Selma Chapter 53, UDC
C/o Patricia S. Godwin
Fort Dixie
10800 Co. Rd. 30
Selma, Alabama 36701

Keepin’ the skeer on’em!
DEO VINDICE!
Patricia S. Godwin

CONTRIBUTION OPPORTUNITIES TO BE A PART OF THIS HISTORIC & MONUMENTAL PROJECT – WE APPRECIATE ANY AND ALL DONATIONS!

4X8 PAVER – $50 – (3 Lines, 18 Characters)

8X8 PAVER – $65 – (6 Lines, 18 Characters)

$500 DONATION – Name/Organization will be listed on “DONORS 500” plaque

$1500 DONATION FOR BRONZE MARKER – Name/Organization will be added at the bottom of the marker

FRIENDS OF FORREST T-SHIRT – $25 (Sizes: M, L, XL, XXL)

8×10 COLOR COLLAGE OF NBF MONUMENT – $10 – (While still at the Smitherman Building Museum in 2000-2001)

oldsouthrebel©zebra.net